Brewing with Ceoliac Disease

All dried and kilned
20230406_133946.jpg

Hit this with 120c for an hour and a half to finish up.
 
Looking impressive Ben
 
Looking to make a lager type beer.
https://www.brewersfriend.com/homebrew/recipe/view/1371855/rice-lager-gf-

I have absolutely no idea how this will turn out but super excited to brew it.
That last mash step is 87c that's the upper limit of rice geletanisation temp.
Of all the brewing grains including barley I found out rice has the highest starch % at 70 percent of the grain so rice has some great PPG potential you've just gotta unlock the starch .

I'm glad no buckwheat is in this one that beta Glucanase mess it is.
 
Wouldn't you be better off with a rice cooker on the side and gelatinise it in that then add it to the mash? Or is that the point of the insanely heat tolerant enzymes you posted about recently?
 
Mark Farrall said:
Wouldn't you be better off with a rice cooker on the side and gelatinise it in that then add it to the mash? Or is that the point of the insanely heat tolerant enzymes you posted about recently?
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Pretty much mate yup half of me is exactly like your saying boil em for 30 and the mash em.

But the other half is saying hey you've created them enzymes there in the grain why not use them.
Eg rice has lots of limit dextrinase in it perfect for attacking 1,6 glucoside linkages which open up the starches to more conversion at the lower beta Glucanase/ beta Amylase rest stage.

The Hitempase will work on the starches right up until a couple minutes into the boil.

Honestly I was originally thinking of a falling mash schedule but after reading My gluten free brewing books segment on mashing a rising slow step mash using Ondea pro and the inbuilt enzymes seem like a goer.

Fingers crossed she's all happening tomorrow.

I understand why my buckwheat mashes didn't convert so well they have some beta Amylase and beta Glucanase enzymes but F all Alpha.
But if I had been patient at the lower end of the mash rest Ondea pro even has some Alpha Amylase enzymes in it with its concoction of enzymes but it denatured at 65c.

So glad I got this book it's really taking the fog off gluten free homebrewing :)
 
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Looks like rice is gunna be my go to base grain after today's brew session.
No beta Glucanase sticky mash mess the rice was just like barley to work with in the kettle.
Also no decanting the supernatant off the grain and boiling then cooling.
The planned rising temperature mash worked a charm and I had an even better flow through the grain than when I've mashed barley.

You can really notice the beta glucan rest helps to improve the lautering flow as you raise up through the mash steps.

Here is mash in
20230411_081921.jpg

Then mid way though after second rest at 62c
20230411_095917.jpg

Little bit clearer but still plenty of unconverted starches
And just before the sparge after last to Alpha Amylase steps 74c 30 mins then 87c 30mins
20230411_105532.jpg

Feels weird heating and mashing at mashout temps.


Looks like I can set the Points per Gallon on the rice up to at least 33ppg

The colour of the wort is nice and lite so I'll stick with this low finishing kiln step on the rice @ 120c for 1.5 hours after the grain has dried back to its original moisture content.

20230411_133630.jpg

Now to get some more rice to malt
 
3kg rice malting

1st air dry after soaking last night
20230413_121541.jpg

See these little nodules on the end of the grain
20230413_121711.jpg

That's what your looking for early on.
That's the start of the acrospire.
This tells you your on the right track and that the seed is viable and starting to germinate.
This will rest untill this evening and I'll give it another overnight soak tonight.
From there it was air dry and start its germination.
The grain will get a little bit sticky or even a tad slimey so I give the grain a rinse once a day while germinating.
This helps with the moisture content and helps rinse off any potential fungal spores.

Hopefully I will have my Solar dehydrator build and ready for action once this batch is finished germination.
 
Trialben said:
Forgot to show the final product!
View attachment 25112
A week's worth of malting.

On that beer I brewed she's came to a grinding halt it seems 1.024 hmmm always something to be learned from this new Coeliac brewing looks like it's staying in the fermenter for longer .
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Or different yeasts.
 
Mark Farrall said:
Something with diastaticus? I've used this in the past on bigger beers and haven't noticed the esters or phenols as I do on the other diastatic yeast - https://www.whitelabs.com/yeast-single?id=146&type=YEAST&style_type=1. Though I've never used it in a simple beer.
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Thankyou Mark ill definitely keep this yeast in mind...
You know my mind went to diastaticus yeast too:p.

It's definitely in the back of my mind as well as some is ir Gluco-amylase enzymes to maybe continue conversion in the fermenter a little.

But I think I just need to get more fermentations under my belt as well.

Next batch I'm doing maybe Anzac Day I'll rack onto the whole Nova lager yeast cake and I'll ferment it as an ale temp.

I'll add my yeast nutrients as I've already been doing and see where fermentation finishes.

So what I've read in regards to rice buckwheat ect they can yield lower FAN naturally in the grains so this can cause poor yeast health and potential stalling towards end of fermentation.

So apparently the Ondea Pro is supposed to release more available free amino nitrogen via its cleavage of the 1,6 starch Linkages making this available to the yeast .

But there is also a link with Ondea Pro ( its an Enzyme blend) also creating more limit Dextrinase which can result in higher finishing gravity. (I believe this is Pullulanase
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pullulanase). [Debranching enzymes]

It also attacks the protine structure therefore also causing reduced foam stability/lacing. (I believe this is Protease).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protease#:~:text=A protease (also called a,formation of new protein products.

So I'm running another mash with Ondea Pro next with all the same mash target rests but I'll treat fermentation a little kinder and won't spund the fermentation plus run it a little hotter therefore hopefully encouraging as much attenuation out of the yeast heck I'll even bump it up even more at the end to round out the fermentation.

So if this doesn't yield satisfactory attenuation % I'm hoping for standard 80% as par for the course.

If not I'll omit the Ondea Pro and just use Apha Amylase and go for the sugar profile this enzyme produces with a similar fermentation profile.

Oh gee I'm really enjoying this rabbit hole atm:)
 
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I though limit dextrinase can be useful for creating more fermentable worts, especially if there's unmalted or less modified grains. But it's a bit problematic as it's a fairly low temp enzyme and it can often be denatured by the time the starch is gelatinised and ready to be cut. And it's another one, like beta glucanase that can be positive for clarity but negative for foam.

Are you doing single infusion mashes or including a lower step? That might help if the problem is starch or unfermentable sugars in the wort. Not that I've played in that space for more than a couple of batches, so it's all just hearsay from me. And especially as you're using those unique enzyme mixes that may work on the same molecules at higher temperatures than the barley enzymes I hear about.
 
Mark Farrall said:
I though limit dextrinase can be useful for creating more fermentable worts, especially if there's unmalted or less modified grains. But it's a bit problematic as it's a fairly low temp enzyme and it can often be denatured by the time the starch is gelatinised and ready to be cut. And it's another one, like beta glucanase that can be positive for clarity but negative for foam.

Are you doing single infusion mashes or including a lower step? That might help if the problem is starch or unfermentable sugars in the wort. Not that I've played in that space for more than a couple of batches, so it's all just hearsay from me. And especially as you're using those unique enzyme mixes that may work on the same molecules at higher temperatures than the barley enzymes I hear about.
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Ah well maybe I've got my facts arse about once again:p.

Yeah multiple step mash beginning 50c within the active range for Beta Glucanase and the limit Dextrinas.
Your dead set right me old mate they all denature as you drift up into saccrification temperatures 60c upwards.

I don't know if you've listened to the bru labs podcast on beta glucans that chick I'm sure said optimal beta Glucanase temp is in the 40's centigrade.
https://spotify.link/eI0dnoitazb

Link to her studies
https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/03610470.2022.2145841

As per Ondea Pro Enzyme blend it denatured at 65c and the different enzymes in this blend are best achieved with the first two steps I've employed at 50c then 61c the next saccrification step I go is 74c this denatures the ondea pro but pushes into by Deltazyme Alpha Amylase enzymes optimal range it also helps with the high starch geletanisation of Gluten free brewing grains especially Rice who's geletanisation temps is quite high.

Thanks for clearing up the limit Dextrins for me
I've read some of these 1,6 Debranching enzymes allow for better starch conversion but I'm not seeing great attenuation but maybe this could be a yeast health thing.

I've never had any fermentation issues in the past with my yeast propagation system so I guess I'll have to repeat a few brews and get better understanding of what's going on.
 
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