Galaxy vs Mosaic Dry Hop in a Pale Ale

[J A]

I'm working up a split batch that'll be an Pale Ale and American Amber. Easy enough to use the Pale Ale grist in the mash and boil for the whole batch and add some steeped dark malts to half after the whirlpool. The Amber half of the recipe should work with just the boil/whirlpool hops in the Pale half minus the dry hop.

For the Pale though, I need to get in more hop aroma and flavor. Dry-hopping isn't as effective as whirlpool but the Centennial and CTZ will give it a good flavor base.
If I didn't do anything else, it would be a decent Pale but I want to push the tropical aroma and flavor. I'll have Galaxy and Mosaic available and can use either or both in combination. I know Mosaic but I've been eager to try some Galaxy after finding a very good local IPA that features it predominately. I've got 4 oz each in the recipe but I don't think I'll go quite that heavy - likely 4 oz of one or the other or a couple ounces of each.

There's no certainly wrong answer as either or both will have a really nice effect against the backdrop of the C-hops but what are some opinions? Any experience with Galaxy?
Here are the two splits:

https://www.brewersfriend.com/homebrew/recipe/view/1547764/american-amber-pale-ale-split-pale

https://www.brewersfriend.com/homebrew/recipe/view/1547765/american-amber-pale-ale-split-amber

 

[Bigbre04]

I have not used Galaxy in recent times.

Centennial/CTZ are both very dank hops IMO. I know it will be good, but if i was going for a tropical flavor profile i would use Cent/CTZ(fine for bittering).

This is on right now. It is really good and tastes like tropical fruit with damn near no bitterness.
https://www.brewersfriend.com/homebrew/recipe/embed/1541664

For maximizing these hops and really differentiating the beers, i would toss voss on the pale ale version and dryhop on day 2. You will get really good biotransformation from both galaxy and mosaic. In my experience(all of my IPAs use Apex Voss) you should get around 80% attenuation on day 4-5 and can/should crash cool and carbonate the beer by day 6 or atleast get it off of the hops around then or you will start getting more vegetal flavors from sitting on the dry hop post ferm. I go into the tank at 96F and set my jackets to keep the ferm below 100f.

I plan my IPA brew days on Thursdays so that i can dry hop it on friday, crash it on monday, and carb/pack it on Tuesday. This schedule is very very consistent for my gear atleast.

 

[J A]

I have not used Galaxy in recent times.

Centennial/CTZ are both very dank hops IMO. I know it will be good, but if i was going for a tropical flavor profile i would use Cent/CTZ(fine for bittering).

This is on right now. It is really good and tastes like tropical fruit with damn near no bitterness.
https://www.brewersfriend.com/homebrew/recipe/embed/1541664

For maximizing these hops and really differentiating the beers, i would toss voss on the pale ale version and dryhop on day 2. You will get really good biotransformation from both galaxy and mosaic. In my experience(all of my IPAs use Apex Voss) you should get around 80% attenuation on day 4-5 and can/should crash cool and carbonate the beer by day 6 or atleast get it off of the hops around then or you will start getting more vegetal flavors from sitting on the dry hop post ferm. I go into the tank at 96F and set my jackets to keep the ferm below 100f.

I plan my IPA brew days on Thursdays so that i can dry hop it on friday, crash it on monday, and carb/pack it on Tuesday. This schedule is very very consistent for my gear atleast.

Great advice! Your recipe looks killer.
As for the dank, I personally really like it in the right balance. The commercial beer that inspires me to use Galaxy is a local West Coast IPA and it's really good but it's just a little light in hop profile. Not that it's lacking hop flavor but it could stand a little more depth and just a touch more bite.

I'd like a little more definition and separation from the malt and make it a little more traditional Northwest style. I find that the CTZ will provide something to contrast the lighter fruit notes and give a a boost to the perceived bitterness without any lingering harshness. Centennial is at home in any IPA, IMO and this should be enough to show some classic hop presence without taking over. The biggest portion of the of the IBUs is coming from the Magnum and that should play along with everything nicely.

Concerning yeast, I like the idea of the Voss but I've got a good supply of other stuff. I figured on US-05 for the Pale Ale and maybe my Mauribrew 497 for the Amber. I've used that for a pale before and it works really well at ale temps. I like the idea of keeping the Amber a little malt-forward and clean. My notes say that a 20 gallon batch of Pale Ale with a good pitch of 497 was at FG on day 4. It was in my big Peltier-cooled fermenter and in warm weather so it was a very slow crash and I kegged at about 2 weeks. I'm sure it would have been possible to keg it within a week of brew day and let it clear in the kegs.
I do want to get some Voss, though. It seems to be a go-to for a lot of home brewers.

 

[Dave Y]

I have done a few Voss fermented pale ales, they ferment quickly, but are more citrusy. Hornindal has a pronounced floral character. I’m curious to hear your results here, as in previous efforts the ‘tropical’ character gets overwhelmed.

Until I used some of the thiolized yeast strains.

This one is with Helio Gazer, 50/50 pils/MO and 2 ounces of hops ; 1 of Idaho 7, 1 of simcoe. No whirlpool or dry hops
I was surprised how clear it came out, lunar crush is super hazy.

This is minimally citrusy, smells very tropical, and tastes like it smells.

I’ve done a few NIEPAs with Galaxy and I like them. They have a good tropical contribution in previous beers.
I have to be careful with the ‘tropical’ hops / yeast because they’re not something the neighbors gravitate to, and they’re a hit with hop heads and nobody else.

 

[J A]

I have done a few Voss fermented pale ales, they ferment quickly, but are more citrusy. Hornindal has a pronounced floral character. I’m curious to hear your results here, as in previous efforts the ‘tropical’ character gets overwhelmed.

Until I used some of the thiolized yeast strains.

This one is with Helio Gazer, 50/50 pils/MO and 2 ounces of hops ; 1 of Idaho 7, 1 of simcoe. No whirlpool or dry hops
I was surprised how clear it came out, lunar crush is super hazy.

This is minimally citrusy, smells very tropical, and tastes like it smells.

I’ve done a few NIEPAs with Galaxy and I like them. They have a good tropical contribution in previous beers.
I have to be careful with the ‘tropical’ hops / yeast because they’re not something the neighbors gravitate to, and they’re a hit with hop heads and nobody else.

Tropicals and juicy hop flavors are overused, I think. I like the flavors and aromas but I always want a balance. I very often use plenty of Simcoe because it'll throw some nice mango in the whirlpool but it'll give nice, smooth dank pine in the earlier additions. Warrior/Simcoe/Mosaic has been a go-to combo for me. I'll use the Chico for this pale because I know what it does and I can better suss out the character of the Galaxy. And the more that I think about it, the more I want to use the Galaxy solo so I can really get a feel for it.

 

[Dave Y]

Tropicals and juicy hop flavors are overused, I think. I like the flavors and aromas but I always want a balance. I very often use plenty of Simcoe because it'll throw some nice mango in the whirlpool but it'll give nice, smooth dank pine in the earlier additions. Warrior/Simcoe/Mosaic has been a go-to combo for me. I'll use the Chico for this pale because I know what it does and I can better suss out the character of the Galaxy. And the more that I think about it, the more I want to use the Galaxy solo so I can really get a feel for it.

thanks, much appreciated. I think the tropicals have are... ‘monochromatic’ in that regard. best I could come up with, but as you pointed out they do lack the balance you write of. The first was to see how far I could take the beer away from the traditional, heavy grapefruit contribution. The next has more malt balance but still is heavily favoring tropical flavors. But, TBF, that’s exactly what I was shooting for at the time. Next effort will be to moderate some of this character and swing them back towards ‘favoring’ tropical rather than all in.

 

[Bigbre04]

Great advice! Your recipe looks killer.

It is super good and is currently outselling my golden lager...which is unusual. I will actually be brewing another similar IPA on Friday since im gonna get wiped out on St. P day.

As for the dank, I personally really like it in the right balance. The commercial beer that inspires me to use Galaxy is a local West Coast IPA and it's really good but it's just a little light in hop profile. Not that it's lacking hop flavor but it could stand a little more depth and just a touch more bite.

for sure on the dank, it can def work well.

I'd like a little more definition and separation from the malt and make it a little more traditional Northwest style. I find that the CTZ will provide something to contrast the lighter fruit notes and give a a boost to the perceived bitterness without any lingering harshness. Centennial is at home in any IPA, IMO and this should be enough to show some classic hop presence without taking over. The biggest portion of the of the IBUs is coming from the Magnum and that should play along with everything nicely.

for sure, I generally prefer the Juicy side of IPAs, i have a recipe for a big westie that i will make sooner or later.

Concerning yeast, I like the idea of the Voss but I've got a good supply of other stuff. I figured on US-05 for the Pale Ale and maybe my Mauribrew 497 for the Amber. I've used that for a pale before and it works really well at ale temps. I like the idea of keeping the Amber a little malt-forward and clean. My notes say that a 20 gallon batch of Pale Ale with a good pitch of 497 was at FG on day 4. It was in my big Peltier-cooled fermenter and in warm weather so it was a very slow crash and I kegged at about 2 weeks. I'm sure it would have been possible to keg it within a week of brew day and let it clear in the kegs.
I do want to get some Voss, though. It seems to be a go-to for a lot of home brewers.

Voss is fantastic. I have made a ton of different styles with it out of necessity. i find it to be fairly clean when treated correctly. It does a super great job with hazy juicy IPAs.

 

[Bigbre04]

thanks, much appreciated. I think the tropicals have are... ‘monochromatic’ in that regard. best I could come up with, but as you pointed out they do lack the balance you write of. The first was to see how far I could take the beer away from the traditional, heavy grapefruit contribution. The next has more malt balance but still is heavily favoring tropical flavors. But, TBF, that’s exactly what I was shooting for at the time. Next effort will be to moderate some of this character and swing them back towards ‘favoring’ tropical rather than all in.

some are better then others. the IPA i posted above has a beautiful guava citrus thing going on with just a hint of bitterness.

This was the previous IPA i had on and it was really good as well. different then the current ones. I wish i had a way to side by side them, but alas it is all gone.
https://www.brewersfriend.com/homebrew/recipe/embed/1533694

 

[J A]

Voss is fantastic. I have made a ton of different styles with it out of necessity. i find it to be fairly clean when treated correctly. It does a super great job with hazy juicy IPAs.

A small local brewery was doing a Voss "Lager" and while it was definitely clean and balanced, it had flavor notes that I just didn't care for. I can see it working better for hop-forward beers. I'm pretty much a lager snob, though. Helles, Pils, Pre-Pro just should really be a certain way. Everything else is a Blonde Ale or Golden Ale, neither of which is unwelcome in any tap line-up, IMO.

 

[Bigbre04]

A small local brewery was doing a Voss "Lager" and while it was definitely clean and balanced, it had flavor notes that I just didn't care for. I can see it working better for hop-forward beers. I'm pretty much a lager snob, though. Helles, Pils, Pre-Pro just should really be a certain way. Everything else is a Blonde Ale or Golden Ale, neither of which is unwelcome in any tap line-up, IMO.

those are my favorites honestly. I just carbed up a double batch of my golden lager and im sipping on a kolsch before i head home. the kolsch is REALLY good. not a lager obviously, but its lager adjacent.

I had my glycol go down for a while last summer and i had to crank out beers with voss. adjust the hops and it will cover alot of yeast flavor.

 

[Sanctuary Brewing]

To answer the original question, I'd use a little of both, maybe 60/40 galaxy/mosaic. I've not dry-hopped with that combination, but have dry hopped citra and galaxy and that is a great combo for a nice citrus nose.

 

[Sanctuary Brewing]

Galaxy(Red)/Citra

Galaxy(Red)/Mosaic

So in your case you're going to get more citrus from the galaxy.

 

[Bigbre04]

I have done a few Voss fermented pale ales, they ferment quickly, but are more citrusy. Hornindal has a pronounced floral character. I’m curious to hear your results here, as in previous efforts the ‘tropical’ character gets overwhelmed.

Until I used some of the thiolized yeast strains.
View attachment 31466

This one is with Helio Gazer, 50/50 pils/MO and 2 ounces of hops ; 1 of Idaho 7, 1 of simcoe. No whirlpool or dry hops
I was surprised how clear it came out, lunar crush is super hazy.

This is minimally citrusy, smells very tropical, and tastes like it smells.

I’ve done a few NIEPAs with Galaxy and I like them. They have a good tropical contribution in previous beers.
I have to be careful with the ‘tropical’ hops / yeast because they’re not something the neighbors gravitate to, and they’re a hit with hop heads and nobody else.

so you are saying that you like the thiolized yeasties? I have not tried them, mainly because they are so damned expensive compared to voss+hops. I also am not sure if i could re use them or if they are sort of single dimensional.

I have not had many or any(that i know of) thiolized yeast beers commercially. i think one of my friends uses them ill give them a chat.


I actually have had the opposite experience on the "non hoppy beer drinkers" front. I can usually change peoples minds on IPAs by chatting with them and sampling the different IPAs and talking about IBUs with them. I have actually converted some of our local "budlight" crowd to drinking Juicy IPAs.

 

[J A]

Galaxy(Red)/CitraView attachment 31469
Galaxy(Red)/MosaicView attachment 31471

So in your case you're going to get more citrus from the galaxy.

Good stuff! I like where Mosaic goes in the comparison graph. Seems like the combination will be nice. I would have thought that there's more tropical and stone fruit in the Galaxy but I guess it does throw a fair amount of sweet citrus. With the Mosaic giving a fair amount of resin/pine (usually reads as dank/pot in the whirlpool/dryhop) it might double up on some of my CTZ contribution.

I ran the same graph with Citra(blue) and Mosaic(green) and it illustrates why that seems to be such a good combo. The Mosaic balances the Citra a little. The Galaxy almost looks like a less intense version of the Citra which is exactly what I'd like to get. I like Citra but it's intense.
The second is Simcoe in red. That's my most used combination and makes sense looking at the graph that it's well rounded with emphasis on the resin/citrus/tropical notes that I like. It'll be really enlightening to see what the Galaxy gives me. Next batch will be my house pale with the Simcoe/Citra/Mosaic combo and I'll be able to compare.

 

[J A]

Okay...now I'm having fun with the comparison graph.
If I plug in my CTZ and Centennial and throw the Mosaic or Galaxy on top of it, I get some interesting results - first is Mosaic(red), Centennial(green), CTZ(blue); second is Galaxy(red), Centennial(green), CTZ(blue). The only thing that seems off to me is that I experience a fair amount of pine in the CTZ.

 

[Sanctuary Brewing]

I ran the same graph with Citra(blue) and Mosaic(green) and it illustrates why that seems to be such a good combo. The Mosaic balances the Citra a little.

Great combination. I make a beer inspired by Altamonte's Maui Waui https://www.brewersfriend.com/homebrew/recipe/view/1483492/fallen-angel All 2-Row 50/50 citra/mosaic and let the hops shine

 

[Bigbre04]

Good stuff! I like where Mosaic goes in the comparison graph. Seems like the combination will be nice. I would have thought that there's more tropical and stone fruit in the Galaxy but I guess it does throw a fair amount of sweet citrus. With the Mosaic giving a fair amount of resin/pine (usually reads as dank/pot in the whirlpool/dryhop) it might double up on some of my CTZ contribution.

I ran the same graph with Citra(blue) and Mosaic(green) and it illustrates why that seems to be such a good combo. The Mosaic balances the Citra a little. The Galaxy almost looks like a less intense version of the Citra which is exactly what I'd like to get. I like Citra but it's intense.
The second is Simcoe in red. That's my most used combination and makes sense looking at the graph that it's well rounded with emphasis on the resin/citrus/tropical notes that I like. It'll be really enlightening to see what the Galaxy gives me. Next batch will be my house pale with the Simcoe/Citra/Mosaic combo and I'll be able to compare.
View attachment 31473View attachment 31474

super interesting how differently people interpret hop flavors.

 

[Dave Y]

so you are saying that you like the thiolized yeasties? I have not tried them, mainly because they are so damned expensive compared to voss+hops. I also am not sure if i could re use them or if they are sort of single dimensional.

I have not had many or any(that i know of) thiolized yeast beers commercially. i think one of my friends uses them ill give them a chat.


I actually have had the opposite experience on the "non hoppy beer drinkers" front. I can usually change peoples minds on IPAs by chatting with them and sampling the different IPAs and talking about IBUs with them. I have actually converted some of our local "budlight" crowd to drinking Juicy IPAs.

I like them, yes. I have not tried the lager iteration yet, but plan on it. I prefer the NEIPA to Westies personally but that’s not to say I don’t enjoy a solid WCIPA. I still have some experimenting to do but in my last use, an APA at 40 IBUs, the dominant characteristic is tropical, even with only a small bittering hop add, and a 10 minute flavor addition - no whirlpool, no dry hops. So I think it’s possible to add some dimension with the right hop additions, but I think it will be like ‘fighting’ the Citra hop “grapefruit overload”. I say that affectionately, I do like Citra but as previously mentioned it has to be ... respected, shall we say? Or may just reduce the tropical hop payload a bit more.

I think the thiolized yeasts add a new dimension to the NEIPA, and used properly you can have a great beer.

 

[Bigbre04]

Now im trying to figure out my hop schedule for the batch that im brewing today.

thinking i might run mostly Idaho 7, maybe blend in some Amarillo(not sure how much i have on hand), Simcoe, Citra?

shooting for around 50 IBU everything late boil/wp/dh. pitching voss. Ill get one of the kitchen guys to dryhop for me tomorrow morning.


This is where i am at right now. This is the same grain bill as the one i posted above, with a different hop schedule! lemme know what you think, im about an hour from boil so.........
https://www.brewersfriend.com/homebrew/recipe/embed/1548818

 

[Dave Y]

I like Idaho 7, have used in several pale ales. I think I might also go simcoe on what you have - but let’s be real; all the hops you have to choose from will make an excellent contribution.