Recipe Advice

[BOB357]

I think our water is relatively soft, this is the report from our supplier:

Should say that this is the summary, there's another one that runs to a few pages.

I don't see anything here that would be bad for brewing. It does list 3 of the 6 ions brewers are most concerned with (Calcium, Magnesium and Sodium) and all levels are fine. If the other pages list Sulfate, Chloride and Bicarbonate levels, you'll have everything you need. This does assume that the water supply remains fairly consistent.

 

[Steve SPF]

Our water is very consistent, one thing we are good at.

Would you add / change anything here or just be happy that you have decent brewing water?

 

[BOB357]

It would be nice to know the levels of the other 3 ions. that would give you all the information you need to use the water calculator. I don't like to recommend water adjustments with incomplete information on the source water. What seem like reasonable adjustments can upset mash chemistry, causing more problems.

Beer can be seasoned after the mash. I wouldn't be afraid at all to add Gypsum or Calcium Chloride at the beginning of the boil. The added Calcium would help with the hot break and final beer clarity as the Chloride or Sulfate helped to emphasise the malt or hops, respectively. Probably worth a try until you're ready to get into proper water adjustment.

 

[HighVoltageMan!]

I think our water is relatively soft, this is the report from our supplier:

Should say that this is the summary, there's another one that runs to a few pages.

The hardness of your water is about 100ppm total hardness, I would dilute that with RO water, 3-4 parts RO and 1 part tap water. That level of hardness (100ppm) in a hoppy/bitter beer will make the bitterness fairly sharp. If your going for sharp bitterness, then use use straight.

As far as using water mod's with your tap water, you need more calcium. 2 grams of calcium chloride and 3 grams of calcium sulfate, that will give you at least 60ppm of calcium.

If it were me, I would start with all RO and add 2 grams of calcium chloride and 4 grams of calcium sulfate and try that, I won a lot of gold medals on that formulation. Water modification isn't brain surgery as some try to make it out to be, the beer will be totally fine.

 

[Steve SPF]

I don't see anything here that would be bad for brewing. It does list 3 of the 6 ions brewers are most concerned with (Calcium, Magnesium and Sodium) and all levels are fine. If the other pages list Sulfate, Chloride and Bicarbonate levels, you'll have everything you need. This does assume that the water supply remains fairly consistent.

So, looking at the full report, it says (I think!)

Chloride Min 4.25 Avg 7.92 Max 16.8 mg CL/L

Sulphate Min 7.52 Avg 35.5 Max 157 mg SO4/L

I can't find Bicarbonate in the full report

 

[Steve SPF]

The hardness of your water is about 100ppm total hardness, I would dilute that with RO water, 3-4 parts RO and 1 part tap water. That level of hardness (100ppm) in a hoppy/bitter beer will make the bitterness fairly sharp. If your going for sharp bitterness, then use use straight.

As far as using water mod's with your tap water, you need more calcium. 2 grams of calcium chloride and 3 grams of calcium sulfate, that will give you at least 60ppm of calcium.

If it were me, I would start with all RO and add 2 grams of calcium chloride and 4 grams of calcium sulfate and try that, I won a lot of gold medals on that formulation. Water modification isn't brain surgery as some try to make it out to be, the beer will be totally fine.

Buying water in is impractical, I'm using around 130lt on a full brewday. I am doing smaller batches now as well but even those are at least 60lt. I can't think of anywhere that sells water in those volumes around here.

When you say add 2 grams what volume of water would that be in?

 

[HighVoltageMan!]

Buying water in is impractical, I'm using around 130lt on a full brewday. I am doing smaller batches now as well but even those are at least 60lt. I can't think of anywhere that sells water in those volumes around here.

When you say add 2 grams what volume of water would that be in?

Per 5 gallons or 19 liters. If you can’t get RO, then add calcium sulfate and calcium chloride to get the right levels to your water. Watch your pH in the mash, keep it between 5.3-5.6 measured at room temperature with acid adjustments, lactic or phosphorus. The pre-boil pH should be 5.2 or so, (add acid to sparge water to keep the pH low during the sparge), the post boil pH should be 5.1-5.2. Adjust each step as necessary with acid. If it gets low, don’t try to raise it.

 

[BOB357]

Using the "typical* numbers listed in your water report, here's your levels for the 6 ions for your water profile.

Calcium (Ca) 30mg/L Magnesium (Mg) 6mg/L Sulfate (SO4) 36mg/L

Sodium (Na) 26mg/L Chloride (Cl) 8mg/L Bicarbonate (HCO3) 119mg/L

I notice that the range for Sulfate is quite broad, so it appears that your water isn't as consistent as you might have thought.
If the other ion ranges are all fairly tight, you could use TDS as an indication of when the Sulfate swings to the high side. This would allow you to better guestimate the level and the Sulfate/Chloride ratio.

As it is, your water definitely favors dark beers and would be good for many lighter styles if you were adjusting mash pH. Hoppy beers would benefit from the higher end of the Sulfate range if you knew when it was present.That's the problem with tap water. Without the ability to test for every batch, you're never sure just where it is.

Have you ever thought of putting together a small batch (4 to 6 liter) BIAB setup for trying out different styles? Pretty inexpensive way to see what else may work well for you.

 

[Steve SPF]

I think you're right about a small batch test setup, I really do need to have a look into that.

You're right about the darker beers as well. I have another batch of the 6% dark/hoppy one I brewed conditioning now and it's just superb.

There's a lot to absorb here, what a fascinating pastime this brewing caper is

 

[BOB357]

Not really as complicated as it seems. After a bunch of reading on the subject it all comes together.

 

[Hopfunk]

This one ain't great. Hoping it will improve but miles away from where I wanted it to be:

https://www.brewersfriend.com/homebrew/recipe/view/919450/citrade-ipa

It didn't get the second dry hop addition so it got 200gm at flameout and 100gm on day 3. No bittering hop so a complete experiment for me but surprisingly bad.

https://www.brewersfriend.com/homebrew/recipe/view/886475/cascitra-ipa

This one is better but there's nothing wow about it. A little too shrp and bitter. Drinkable but not brilliant.

In my opinion your recipes seem a bit unbalanced. The first is a bit low in IBU and the second is way too high in IBU. I would recommend to base your recipes on a balanced profile. For example if your aiming for an American ipa, a 6% ipa would be well balanced with 50-60 IBU. 7% would be balanced with 60-70 IBU etc. if your going for a NE ipa then go a bit lower on IBU, maybe 10-15 units less.

May I ask why you use torrified wheat?

 

[Steve SPF]

May I ask why you use torrified wheat?

Head retention primarily, but I like a little haze as well. A good head is essential in my part of the world although hazy beers are still a very tough sell, particularly hazy cask beers.

The first recipe was very intentionally low in bitterness, no bittering hops - in fact no boiled hops at all. It was a real experiment for me, just trying to find something that gave me a real juicy flavour and aroma; bitterness wasn't a factor in this one.

That other recipe, yes, I would definitely dial back the bitterness if I brewed it again.

I think the water isn't helping with either of these recipes as well so that's a factor, I will look at water adjustments before brewing this style of beer again.

 

[RJC Hops]

[QUOTE = "Steve SPF, publicación: 96609, miembro: 38892"] Así que mis cervezas más oscuras, maltosas, de estilo inglés están realmente donde las quiero. Tengo un IPA tradicional del 6% recién terminado y estoy muy, muy contento con él, además de un par de otros que no cambiaría.

Sigo tratando de elaborar lo que considero un IPA del "nuevo mundo", que quiero ser limpio y crujiente con muchos sabores cítricos y jugosos y no puedo conseguir uno que dé en el clavo y me pregunto qué me he equivocado.

Yo uso la misma malta base, así que me pregunto si eso es un problema, y también uso mucha Cascade y estoy sospechando de eso.

Ninguna de las cervezas son dumpers, pero aún no he encontrado una que me haga 'guau'. ¿Alguna idea sobre dónde podría estar yendo mal o, alternativamente, alguna receta que pueda llevarme por el camino correcto?

Gracias de antemano por la ayuda, como siempre. [/ QUOTE]
Deberias cotir la receta. Tecnicas de lupulado y lupulos usados.

 

[Steve SPF]

Blimey! I don't remember saying that!

 

[HighVoltageMan!]

Blimey! I don't remember saying that!

You must be sampling too much beer!

 

[Steve SPF]

You must be sampling too much beer!

Always a possibility