Boiling citra

[jb1986]

Hello,

I would like to brew a white IPA and found the recipe for Pan Ipani.

Reading the recipe I reallized that citra is added at the beginning of the boil and remembered reading that it is a bad idea. It would produce a harsh bitterness?

Anybody already tried it?
Is a small amount of citra ok or would you use another hop instead? Maybe exchange with a part of mosaic used for dry hopping?

Or dont change a recipe that seems to be very appreciated?

Nany thanks!

 

[GFHomebrew]

Hello,

I would like to brew a white IPA and found the recipe for Pan Ipani.

Reading the recipe I reallized that citra is added at the beginning of the boil and remembered reading that it is a bad idea. It would produce a harsch bitterness?

Anybody already tried it?
Is a small amount of citra ok or would you use another hop instead? Maybe exchange with a part of mosaic used for dry hopping?

Or dont change a recipe that seems to be very appreciated?

Nany thanks!

I'd personally get the boil IBUs from Magnum and leave the citra for after the boil.

I've never used citra at 60 minutes so can't help you on the harsh bittering thing but I have herd this harsh bitterness thing.

 

[The Brew Mentor]

Can you post the recipe? .
That's the best place to start.
Based on the name, it's an IPA, so it's supposed to be bitter or at least hop intense, so maybe that's what the recipe is supposed to be.
Think Arrogant Bastard as an example.
Cheers

 

[dmtaylor]

Citra is generally low cohumulone, so I wouldn't be afraid to use it for bittering.

 

[HighVoltageMan!]

I think the main reason Citra is not used for bittering is because it's such a great hop for late additions, whirlpooling and dry hopping. The bittering addition can be done with cheaper hops that are better suited to the job. Like Ben suggested, Magnum is a great hop used almost exclusively for bittering.

It's likely the beer will be fine. The last couple of years IPA's have shifted to a softer bittering with a huge late hop addition, making it "hoppy" without being overly bitter.

 

[Sandy Feet]

It is your beer. It depends on how harsh you want it.
I like to bitter with Cascade, and I'm not a real big fan of Citra unless it is used very sparingly. Others love it.
I do love Mosaic as a late addition.

 

[Megary]

Agree with those that think Citra would be fine as a bittering hop, if not necessarily playing to its strengths.

I made a Citra SMaSH a few years ago that was not harshly bitter in any way. It was a complete Grapefruit bomb, however.

 

[Steve SPF]

I wouldn't use Citra as a bittering hop on cost grounds alone; I think we were at £35 a kilo last time I saw a price. It seems like a real waste of an exceptionally aromatic hop to me as well.

 

[GFHomebrew]

Actually this latest podcast from the brulab has my ears pricked at possibly using spent dry hops like for instance "Citra" for boil hops.
https://open.spotify.com/episode/726XQRSaiilRfN4PjE6t3s?si=mQ6r50-1RiSMKY1KcbywZg

I remember hearing that 2/3rds of the bittering compounds are still left over in the used dry hops.
So you could then go and use them for boil hops if you stored them in the freezer.

Giving hops a second use and more bang for your Dry hop buck.

 

[Steve SPF]

That's an interesting thought, any way of measuring what's left in them? Maybe a 'brew it and see' approach might be enough for some?

 

[SabreSteve]

I've also done a Citra SMaSH and while overall I didn't love it I definitely didn't get a harsh bitterness from that

 

[jb1986]

Thats the recipe. But i will use t-58 instead of us-05.

 

[Steve SPF]

I've also done a Citra SMaSH and while overall I didn't love it I definitely didn't get a harsh bitterness from that

I think some of them really don't need any bittering. When we're brewing something aromatic and pale - Cascade, Citra, Amarillo single hop - I only use 10gm of bittering hops in an 85lt boil. Not quite brave enough to leave it out but miniscule amounts

 

[GFHomebrew]

That's an interesting thought, any way of measuring what's left in them? Maybe a 'brew it and see' approach might be enough for some?

Sorta what I'm thinking so the Alpha Acid contributes 2/3rds of what they would be if fresh.

Easier to do if your bagging your hops for dry hop or using a canister style dry hopper.


I guess I'd just use a third more or another approach lets say ibus for citra are 18ibus then input them in the calculator as 12ibus then use this to get your boil addition bitterness.

 

[The Brew Mentor]

Thats the recipe. But i will use t-58 instead of us-05.

Do you have another hop to use for bittering? if so, sub it out, if not, I'd just go with it.
As far as yeast goes though, I wouldn't use T-58.
That'll completely change it.
That is, unless that's what you're after.

 

[Craigerrr]

I have heard some people comment that they didn't like the bitterness from Citra hops, but those are purely subjective opinions. The only reason that I have never bittered with Citra is for purely financial reasons, it is pretty close to twice the price.

 

[Sandy Feet]

My opinion was very subjective. I had it in a single hop Pale Ale, and I was just not very fond of it. I'm weird in that I like to bitter with the lower/mid alpha hops too.
I know you want mouthfeel in an IPA, but do any of y'all think that the 14% adjuncts in that recipe is a little high? I wouldn't go above 10, but again, personal preference. State an opinion and learn from others

 

[jb1986]

I have cascade cones from my garden or warrior pellets that I could use. Would then use citra for dry hopping.

I want a white IPA, thats why T-58 instead of us-05.

 

[The Brew Mentor]

I have cascade cones from my garden or warrior pellets that I could use. Would then use citra for dry hopping.

I want a white IPA, thats why T-58 instead of us-05.

T-58 is a Belgian strain that has phenolic flavors of clove and pepper, or spicy.
I believe that style would be more suited to a Belgian wit strain which is more subtle, but again, it's your vision.
I'd go with a small dose of the warrior as the bittering addition. That's a solid bittering hop for an IPA

 

[jb1986]

T-58 is a Belgian strain that has phenolic flavors of clove and pepper, or spicy.
I believe that style would be more suited to a Belgian wit strain which is more subtle, but again, it's your vision.
I'd go with a small dose of the warrior as the bittering addition. That's a solid bittering hop for an IPA

Isnt that the definition of a white IPA? Ipa with wit yeast.

From bcjp:

21B. Specialty IPA: White IPA
Overall Impression

A fruity, spicy, refreshing version of an American IPA, but with a lighter color, less body, and featuring either the distinctive yeast and/or spice additions typical of a Belgian witbier.