Saving Dry Hopped Yeast

[BilltownBrewingCo]

Hello all- I have a bit of a timing dilema, which is slightly complicated by yeast stress.

I currently have a dry-hopped cold IPA as well as a baltic porter, both in the realm of 1.062. I pitched 5 packets of 34/70 into each of the 4 fermentation vessels and heavily oxygenated them (Both beers were made in 10 gallon batches, and are split into fermentation vessels large enough for 5+ gallon batches- so 4, 5 gallon ferments). I will be dry hopping the Cold IPA, and the porter is getting a bourbon tincture with cocoa nibs and 6lbs of red raspberries.

I plan on kegging both of these beers on March 22nd. I was hoping to wash and keep what should be a large amount of 34/70 in order to ferment a festbier (1.057) I plan to brew on May 3rd ideally, or possibly may 10th. I would like to keg that beer on June 15th to start lagering, but I also plan to brew a dopplebock that same day, and the festbier will be a great starter for that beer- and wheather the Festbier gets fresh 34/70 packets, or is using the yeast from the batches I am fermenting now, I plan to simply toss the 1.072 Dopplebock wort directly onto the yeast cake of that festbier. I don't plan on drinking the dopple until Chrsitmas.

My Concern-
1. Can I use yeasts from both of the currently fermenting beers, or just one of them even though they've had dry hoppings and fruit additions etc? Obviously I know I can, but would it cause issues?
2. Will the washed yeast keep in the fridge and still be viable from March 22nd until May 3rd (or 10th)- I can do a viability starter if needed prior to the May brew day.

Assumign there are 200B viable cells in 1 sache of Saflager 34/70, I will need to buy at a minimum 6, but likely 8 saches for the Festbier. At $10 per sachet out the door it's not like it's going to break me or anything, but if I can save a large chunk of yeast from these batches it would be nice.

 

[Dave Y]

I’ve not tried it because I’ve seen quite a bit of lore indicating it wouldn’t be advisable. If it were going in another hop forward beer... Maybe? But Festbier the hops are merely the supporting cast.

I’ve definitely harvested / repitched yeast among German style lagers but not this kind of leap.

 

[HighVoltageMan!]

I plan on kegging both of these beers on March 22nd. I was hoping to wash and keep what should be a large amount of 34/70 in order to ferment a festbier (1.057) I plan to brew on May 3rd ideally, or possibly may 10th. I would like to keg that beer on June 15th

That's a long time to leave them in the fermenter. I typically ferment and keg a cold IPA with 34/70 in @ 2-3 weeks. The yeast is pretty much unusable from the IPA, it's mostly hop debris. You would have save a lot of yeast. Storing it that long would cause a good percentage of yeast to die and what's left isn't in that good of shape. You will save a little money, but you risk losing a beer to a bad fermentation.

I pitch 3 packs rehydrated of 34/70 in a 7 gallon; 1.065 gravity beer (Cold IPA) at 62F and it takes off in @ 10-12 hours. This works really well, makes excellent beer. You can get by with less yeast if the pitch and ferment at a higher temperature. 34/70 is really clean from 62-64F, even without pressure.

I have also used one pack of 34/70 yeast in a 4 liter starter. I make it about 4-5 days before brewing. I leave it on the stir plate for 18-24 hours and then cold crash it so I can decant it just before pitching. I have made 1.054 lagers pitched at 50F with very good success. You will need to aerate 34/70 if you save the liquid yeast or run it through a starter.

The other alternative is to find a cheaper source of yeast, RiteBrew has 34/70 for 5 bucks a pack. Link is below for the yeast:

https://www.ritebrew.com/product-p/830246.htm

One of the big advantages of dry yeast is that it doesn't require aeration. Once you harvest it, you will need to get the oxygen level to @ 12 ppm in the wort at the time of pitch for lagers and @ 8 ppm if you pitch above 60F

Good luck!

 

[Bigbre04]

Hello all- I have a bit of a timing dilema, which is slightly complicated by yeast stress.

I currently have a dry-hopped cold IPA as well as a baltic porter, both in the realm of 1.062. I pitched 5 packets of 34/70 into each of the 4 fermentation vessels and heavily oxygenated them (Both beers were made in 10 gallon batches, and are split into fermentation vessels large enough for 5+ gallon batches- so 4, 5 gallon ferments). I will be dry hopping the Cold IPA, and the porter is getting a bourbon tincture with cocoa nibs and 6lbs of red raspberries.

I plan on kegging both of these beers on March 22nd. I was hoping to wash and keep what should be a large amount of 34/70 in order to ferment a festbier (1.057) I plan to brew on May 3rd ideally, or possibly may 10th. I would like to keg that beer on June 15th to start lagering, but I also plan to brew a dopplebock that same day, and the festbier will be a great starter for that beer- and wheather the Festbier gets fresh 34/70 packets, or is using the yeast from the batches I am fermenting now, I plan to simply toss the 1.072 Dopplebock wort directly onto the yeast cake of that festbier. I don't plan on drinking the dopple until Chrsitmas.

My Concern-
1. Can I use yeasts from both of the currently fermenting beers, or just one of them even though they've had dry hoppings and fruit additions etc? Obviously I know I can, but would it cause issues?
2. Will the washed yeast keep in the fridge and still be viable from March 22nd until May 3rd (or 10th)- I can do a viability starter if needed prior to the May brew day.

Assumign there are 200B viable cells in 1 sache of Saflager 34/70, I will need to buy at a minimum 6, but likely 8 saches for the Festbier. At $10 per sachet out the door it's not like it's going to break me or anything, but if I can save a large chunk of yeast from these batches it would be nice.

I would just buy a block of Apex Munich lager use it and vacuum seal the remainder. At $10/packet you could buy a 500g block from ldcarlson for like $80?

I am not sure that i would trust a yeast that is already stressed to be great after a few months sitting...we generally considered a yeast brink dead after about 2 weeks unless we could varify it with a cell count.

 

[BilltownBrewingCo]

I would just buy a block of Apex Munich lager use it and vacuum seal the remainder. At $10/packet you could buy a 500g block from ldcarlson for like $80?

I am not sure that i would trust a yeast that is already stressed to be great after a few months sitting...we generally considered a yeast brink dead after about 2 weeks unless we could varify it with a cell count.

ok- did not realize i can vacuum seal it! My whole issue with buying it in larger quantities is I was unaware on how I would store the remaining yeast. Appreciate that!

Feel extra dumb bc I have a vacuum sealer... this was kind of in front of my face the whole time.

 

[BilltownBrewingCo]

That's a long time to leave them in the fermenter. I typically ferment and keg a cold IPA with 34/70 in @ 2-3 weeks. The yeast is pretty much unusable from the IPA, it's mostly hop debris. You would have save a lot of yeast. Storing it that long would cause a good percentage of yeast to die and what's left isn't in that good of shape. You will save a little money, but you risk losing a beer to a bad fermentation.

I pitch 3 packs rehydrated of 34/70 in a 7 gallon; 1.065 gravity beer (Cold IPA) at 62F and it takes off in @ 10-12 hours. This works really well, makes excellent beer. You can get by with less yeast if the pitch and ferment at a higher temperature. 34/70 is really clean from 62-64F, even without pressure.

I have also used one pack of 34/70 yeast in a 4 liter starter. I make it about 4-5 days before brewing. I leave it on the stir plate for 18-24 hours and then cold crash it so I can decant it just before pitching. I have made 1.054 lagers pitched at 50F with very good success. You will need to aerate 34/70 if you save the liquid yeast or run it through a starter.

The other alternative is to find a cheaper source of yeast, RiteBrew has 34/70 for 5 bucks a pack. Link is below for the yeast:

https://www.ritebrew.com/product-p/830246.htm

One of the big advantages of dry yeast is that it doesn't require aeration. Once you harvest it, you will need to get the oxygen level to @ 12 ppm in the wort at the time of pitch for lagers and @ 8 ppm if you pitch above 60F

Good luck!

It is- 5 weeks in the ferm- totally aware it doesn't take this long. However, I live in the KC area, and my brewery is in Iowa at my folk's farm. I trade the ease of scheduling my brews for unlimited space and infinante tools. Unfortunately sometimes it means I have to stretch timelines on some things.

I do aprpeciate the cheaper yeast sourcing info though, Thanks!

 

[Bigbre04]

ok- did not realize i can vacuum seal it! My whole issue with buying it in larger quantities is I was unaware on how I would store the remaining yeast. Appreciate that!

Feel extra dumb bc I have a vacuum sealer... this was kind of in front of my face the whole time.

ya man! i have a bunch of half bags in the cooler at the moment. i have used some old stuff without any issue. dry yeast is really tough. keep the o2 and light out and in the fridge and it will last a long time.

 

[Donoroto]

Hello all- I have a bit of a timing dilema, which is slightly complicated by yeast stress.

I currently have a dry-hopped cold IPA as well as a baltic porter, both in the realm of 1.062. I pitched 5 packets of 34/70 into each of the 4 fermentation vessels and heavily oxygenated them (Both beers were made in 10 gallon batches, and are split into fermentation vessels large enough for 5+ gallon batches- so 4, 5 gallon ferments). I will be dry hopping the Cold IPA, and the porter is getting a bourbon tincture with cocoa nibs and 6lbs of red raspberries.

I plan on kegging both of these beers on March 22nd. I was hoping to wash and keep what should be a large amount of 34/70 in order to ferment a festbier (1.057) I plan to brew on May 3rd ideally, or possibly may 10th. I would like to keg that beer on June 15th to start lagering, but I also plan to brew a dopplebock that same day, and the festbier will be a great starter for that beer- and wheather the Festbier gets fresh 34/70 packets, or is using the yeast from the batches I am fermenting now, I plan to simply toss the 1.072 Dopplebock wort directly onto the yeast cake of that festbier. I don't plan on drinking the dopple until Chrsitmas.

My Concern-
1. Can I use yeasts from both of the currently fermenting beers, or just one of them even though they've had dry hoppings and fruit additions etc? Obviously I know I can, but would it cause issues?
2. Will the washed yeast keep in the fridge and still be viable from March 22nd until May 3rd (or 10th)- I can do a viability starter if needed prior to the May brew day.

Assumign there are 200B viable cells in 1 sache of Saflager 34/70, I will need to buy at a minimum 6, but likely 8 saches for the Festbier. At $10 per sachet out the door it's not like it's going to break me or anything, but if I can save a large chunk of yeast from these batches it would be nice.

The hops in that yeast will flavor the new beer. How much is debatable. Washing the yeast might be ok, but I’m afraid if contamination doing that…so I don’t.

I keep harvested yeast 2 months routinely, it can go a bit longer.

 

[Ward Chillington]

Plus1 on Don's 2 months or longer. The trick is sanitary to almost steril containers IMHO.

I would not use the fruited batch, washed or not and washing on the home level can add more vectors to contamination then it's worth. Just take the lesser hopped trub, give it a swirl to break up the cake and into a boiled clean Mason jar, lose cap it and into the fridge. If you want to, a starter from that can be made 2 months later.

Kveik is even more forgiving to that kind of storage.

 

[BilltownBrewingCo]

Plus1 on Don's 2 months or longer. The trick is sanitary to almost steril containers IMHO.

I would not use the fruited batch, washed or not and washing on the home level can add more vectors to contamination then it's worth. Just take the lesser hopped trub, give it a swirl to break up the cake and into a boiled clean Mason jar, lose cap it and into the fridge. If you want to, a starter from that can be made 2 months later.

Kveik is even more forgiving to that kind of storage.

I used to use Voss as my house yeast. Took it out 20 generations and every one was great. Love that yeast for anything hoppy. Also does great with just neutral at normal ale temps.

But... I think with this I'm simply going to do fresh yeast for the festbier then toss dopplebock onto the yeast cake. Too much grain and time to be concerned about contamination.

 

[Brew Cat]

what are you fermenting in ? can you harvest before your dry hop? conical?
Howdy brewing has Cellar Science Cali $2.63

 

[Ward Chillington]

. Too much grain and time to be concerned about contamination.

? Huh?

 

[Brew Cat]

? Huh?

I believe he means to much invested to chance contaminated yeast ruining the batch

 

[Ward Chillington]

Or at this point....as in that ship has sailed?