Red X as a base malt in a cream ale?

[Brewer #334545]

Anyone with experience here? is it too strongly flavoured to be used as a base malt?
Thanks

 

[GFHomebrew]

Not used it personally.
But won't it be too dark colour wise for cream Ale. Red lager or Ale might be a better fit.
I've herd it's quite malty.

Can you describe what your trying to do with this beer.

My understanding is that cream Ale is a lite coloured beer with adjuncts like corn and rice in it.

 

[Brewer #334545]

Not used it personally.
But won't it be too dark colour wise for cream Ale. Red lager or Ale might be a better fit.
I've herd it's quite malty.

Can you describe what your trying to do with this beer.

My understanding is that cream Ale is a lite coloured beer with adjuncts like corn and rice in it.

Take a look at Kilkenny cream ale it’s a darker copper colour. I’m not going for accurate srm I am just hoping it will work for a ball park flavour

 

[GFHomebrew]

Take a look at Kilkenny cream ale it’s a darker copper colour. I’m not going for accurate srm I am just hoping it will work for a ball park flavour

Well if it's a more darker almost red Ale your going for id believe this would bode well in that style.
I'm thinking red X with a tweek of dark roasted barley to get the colours where you want it would be great.

See what other think that have actually brewed with Red X.

 

[Josh Hughes]

Kilkenny cream ale isn’t a “cream ale” in the sense American cream ales. I like Red X. But I have only used it in German lagers. I went about 10% but it will fully convert so you’d be fine there. As for too strong, probably for a cream ale but maybe not at just the amount to get color. I think it could be super tasty actually

 

[Dornbox]

Like @Josh Hughes ive mostly used it for German stuff but I did do a smash Oktoberfest with it. It’s a blend of malts already though so technically it’s not a smash. Regardless I liked it. The beer itself was a tad sweet but I place that more on low attenuation than anything. After that I’ve used it to add some color into other styles because I had a bunch of it.

 

[Over The Cliff Brewing]

Melanoidin malt will give you the red/copper color in a standard cream ale malt bill. I've used red X as a base malt in a darker ale, it's a bit strong for a cream ale

 

[Nosybear]

It would be an awfully strong base malt for a cream ale.... Cream ale is generally very pale, as pale or paler than Pilsner. On the other hand, it's your beer....

 

[GFHomebrew]

It would be an awfully strong base malt for a cream ale.... Cream ale is generally very pale, as pale or paler than Pilsner. On the other hand, it's your beer....

I though cream ale also has adjuncts like rice and maze as like 20% of grain bill?

 

[BarbarianBrewer]

I though cream ale also has adjuncts like rice and maze as like 20% of grain bill?

Correct. I do a cream ale that has 12% flaked corn and 12% flaked barley. Next time I plan to shift closer to 15/10.

 

[GFHomebrew]

Correct. I do a cream ale that has 12% flaked corn and 12% flaked barley. Next time I plan to shift closer to 15/10.

Mate this is a style I've not brewed in along time.
Is this a pre prohibition style beer or linked to it? Something about immigrant German brewers adapting to what was readily available at the time and brewing with it?

 

[BarbarianBrewer]

Mate this is a style I've not brewed in along time.
Is this a pre prohibition style beer or linked to it? Something about immigrant German brewers adapting to what was readily available at the time and brewing with it?

That's what I remember about the history of Cream Ale as well. The corn or rice was needed because the barley grown in the US had too much protein. So, corn or rice was added to reduce the protein and lighten the body. Contrary to popular belief corn and rice were actually more expensive than barley so using them was definitely not for cost saving reasons. Whatever the history, it tastes great.

 

[The Brew Mentor]

Red X is very malty and will produce a beer that depending on % used, will be red.
I would compare it to a dark munch malt.
Maybe even that with a bit of caramel 90.
As much as I like it, if you use it, it won't make a Cream ale.
I'd say go for it, and then just re name the beer based on what your perception is when it's finished.
Let us know

 

[Ward Chillington]

I'm with Nosy...what's your recipe?

Contrary to popular belief corn and rice were actually more expensive than barley so using them was definitely not for cost saving reasons.

Supposedly the most expensive ingredient in Budweiser is the rice!

 

[Nosybear]

I though cream ale also has adjuncts like rice and maze as like 20% of grain bill?

It does. The back story is that American barley (six-row) was harsh and grainy. Brewers learned to use adjuncts to cut that characteristic. That's why American recipes use so much adjunct - maize and rice are cheap, very low in protein and can make six-row palatable. I like maize more than rice, rice is just about purely neutral, corn gives a slight feed-corn flavor.

 

[GFHomebrew]

It does. The back story is that American barley (six-row) was harsh and grainy. Brewers learned to use adjuncts to cut that characteristic. That's why American recipes use so much adjunct - maize and rice are cheap, very low in protein and can make six-row palatable. I like maize more than rice, rice is just about purely neutral, corn gives a slight feed-corn flavor.

Now is Kentucky Common along a similar vein in it being an pre prohibition beverage brewed with corn and maize or am I getting confused here?

OK Here is bjcp for cream ale https://www.bjcp.org/style/2021/1/1C/cream-ale/

 

[Ward Chillington]

My opinion is that they are pretty much the same.

 

[Nosybear]

Now is Kentucky Common along a similar vein in it being an pre prohibition beverage brewed with corn and maize or am I getting confused here?
Same idea. Louisville has hard water so the German brewers figured out that they need dark malt for its acidity.
OK Here is bjcp for cream ale https://www.bjcp.org/style/2021/1/1C/cream-ale/