Need help reading recipes

[Brewer #404298]

Hi. Newish to brewing, never posted a question on here before.

Just trying to understand the format of the recipes and the wording. Some questions.

On this recipe. https://www.brewersfriend.com/homebrew/recipe/view/1084979/oatmeal-stout-french-toast-smores

1. Seems incomplete as there is nothing listed in the recipe that maple syrup or cinnamon or anything else that would bring out taste or aroma of french toast or smores. Am I missing something or is the recipe not specify?
2. It says the preboil is 7 gallons, but if you add the 5.25 gallon strike water and the 4 gallon spare that is 9.25 gallons. The fermenter size is 6 gallons. So am I really using 9.25 gallons and then I boil off 3.25 gallons or am I understanding this wrong?

On this one: https://www.brewersfriend.com/homebrew/recipe/view/948270/french-toast-stout, recipe says 1lb Maple Syrup late kettle addition, but the later under other ingredients, it says secondary, 7 days. Do you think they is racking to a secondary fermenter (which I understand is not common any more). So, 7 days in primary, 7 days in secondary?

Thanks. Any help is appreciated.

 

[Donoroto]

Hi. Newish to brewing, never posted a question on here before.

Just trying to understand the format of the recipes and the wording. Some questions.

On this recipe. https://www.brewersfriend.com/homebrew/recipe/view/1084979/oatmeal-stout-french-toast-smores

1. Seems incomplete as there is nothing listed in the recipe that maple syrup or cinnamon or anything else that would bring out taste or aroma of french toast or smores. Am I missing something or is the recipe not specify?
2. It says the preboil is 7 gallons, but if you add the 5.25 gallon strike water and the 4 gallon spare that is 9.25 gallons. The fermenter size is 6 gallons. So am I really using 9.25 gallons and then I boil off 3.25 gallons or am I understanding this wrong?

On this one: https://www.brewersfriend.com/homebrew/recipe/view/948270/french-toast-stout, recipe says 1lb Maple Syrup late kettle addition, but the later under other ingredients, it says secondary, 7 days. Do you think they is racking to a secondary fermenter (which I understand is not common any more). So, 7 days in primary, 7 days in secondary?

Thanks. Any help is appreciated.

I can only comment on the water. Not only do you boil off a bit, but you lose a bunch to malt and, to a lesser extent, hops.

Some of the ingredients in that recipe will give honey-like flavors. Not sure about maple or cinnamon though.

Others will surely comment.

 

[Ozarks Mountain Brewery]

most recipes are really specific to each persons equipment and process, if you like one it's best to ignore specifics since most people brew a little different, if your new to brewing its best to start with easy and work your way to complicated, you can copy a recipe then edit it to your needs also

 

[GFHomebrew]

As per the stout recipe old mate is soaking the vanilla and cinnamon in bourbon for the course of the fermentation (probably 1 week) then adding this to the keg at packaging.

The maple syrup and the brown sugar are indicated late boil additions maybe at 10 to go along with the lactose and nutrient I'd go.

I see old mates boiling some vanilla 10 to go as well I'd leave that to the fermenter flame out at the most...

 

[TetersMillBrewing]

It says the preboil is 7 gallons, but if you add the 5.25 gallon strike water and the 4 gallon spare that is 9.25 gallons. The fermenter size is 6 gallons. So am I really using 9.25 gallons and then I boil off 3.25 gallons or am I understanding this wrong?

As already stated, most of the recipes are based on specific types of hardware. I fly sparge and leave water on the grain when sparging is complete, so my sparge water requirements plus my strike water are always higher than what I end up in my boil.

Boil off rate is different between equipment. As is the amount left in the boil tank, coils, and so on. So you will need to adjust everything to your specific equipment. This includes adjusting your grain bill based on efficiency of equipment, batch size and so on. I started with kits and have built from there as I adjusted the software for my equipment.

 

[Bigbre04]

An easy way to translate to your gear is to look at a recipe and ignore the weights and such. Just look at the %s and the types of grain.

For hops just look at the expected IBUs and equivalent flavor profiles. Don't worry about the weights. It is also important to note if people are using Cryo hops since they are about twice as potent as standard t90s.

Sometimes you will find odd ball stuff from tiny or local maltsters that you may not have access too. In that case look for equivalents on google that you would have access to.

You need to sort out your equipement. Do a basic recipe and start with a set volume(ex: 5 gals) add your ingredients. Pull out your grains, let them drip back or wash through them to get back to the original volume(take note on how much water was left after your grains were pulled). do your 1 hour boil and then take note how much volume you lost in 1 hour(use online calculators and a ruler to find the volume of a cylinder if your pot does not have measurement marks on it.

IF you are looking for a specific volume at the end you also need to see how much wort you actually end up with after you dump your hops and trub. You will also need to account for fermentation losses and hop losses.

Example:

i want 4 full 1/2s(2BBLs or 62 gals) of finished product.
I start with 80 gals of expected wort. I know that my boil is pretty crap so i wont quite get down to my calculated 76 gals post boil but that doesnt matter a ton. I also loose about an inch of wort to the design of my brewhouse before hops. Through trial and error, i know that if i start with 80 gals of wort, even with my highest loss IPAs, I will always end up with 4 1/2s of finished beer. On beers with less hop loss in the kettle and no dryhop, I will leave some beer, but this is acceptable as I have full kegs.

I hope that helps.

 

[Mont Y. Märzen]

As for the first recipe, the French Toast & S'mores are coming from the malts, nothing needs to be added to get these flavors. Read up on each of those malts individually from their suppliers and take note of the percentages used. (some malts express differently at varying percentages)

I read the second recipe as using 1# of Maple in *both* the boil and the 'secondary'. It may not be necessary to do both, but I'm guessing the intent was originally to get more gravity by putting it in the boil (and be able to fully incorporate it) and the brewer found that it fermented too dry with weaker Maple flavor than intended, so they 'back sweetened' with more Maple.

On that note, those are both complicated recipes. If you're just starting out, you're trying to fly an SR-71 before you learn to walk. But it might turn out really tasty, and it doesn't hurt to try!

 

[Mont Y. Märzen]

In the first recipe, it seems that the additional ingredients like maple syrup and cinnamon are missing from the recipe. You can reach out to the recipe author for clarification. For the preboil volume, it's likely a mistake; typically, you would calculate your volumes to match your fermenter size.

I've made French Toast for decades and never used Maple Syrup or Cinnamon. (just bread, burnt Sugar, Eggs & Milk, sometimes Vanilla) Smores are: toasted Marshmallow, Chocolate & Graham Cracker. All of that is obtainable from the listed grain bill. Unless I'm missing something, I don't even see Maple Syrup or Cinnamon mentioned in the beer recipe at all. Perhaps folks found a non-traditional recipe for those two foods online and think they belong there?

I don't sparge, but the recipe math appears to work. 9.25gal total water minus pre-boil is 2.25gal loss to grain absorption. At 17.5#, that would be just over ½-quart per pound which is typical for a 2-3 pot system especially if there is 2-4 quart loss below the mash tun false bottom. (which would result in ≈.4qt/#) I get .3qt/# loss to grain but I do BIAB and squeeze the snot out of the bag, so .4–.5 without squeezing is about right and matches my buddies system.

But it wouldn't hurt to ask the recipe author for sure to confirm. Or just trust the recipe and brew the beer!

 

[GFHomebrew]

It's in that second recipe in the other ingredients section and the maple is in there and late kettle addition in fermentables section.

 

[Brewer #404298]

On that note, those are both complicated recipes. If you're just starting out, you're trying to fly an SR-71 before you learn to walk. But it might turn out really tasty, and it doesn't hurt to try!

@Mont Y. Märzen
I laughed out loud about the SR-71 comparison! Thanks for details. Since I am just learning to read these recipes, help me understand what you were seeing in the recipes that makes them complicated.

 

[Mont Y. Märzen]

I laughed out loud about the SR-71 comparison! Thanks for details. Since I am just learning to read these recipes, help me understand what you were seeing in the recipes that makes them complicated.

Sure.

Recipe #1
*Has 7 (but his notes show he used 8) different malts. Do you know why each one is there? What flavors and aromas each one contributes? What percentages are enough to detect them? Which ones could be left out or substituted? I'm not saying each one doesn't play a vital or even important nuanced part, but without knowing what each malt does, that is complication.
*Uses Sparging, *and* treats the strike and sparging water separately with salts. Sparging isn't the easiest thing to get right and especially with all of those dark grains, can get you lots of astringency if not done properly. I wouldn't say that method is a good one for even your first 10 brews. (I'm sure many folks here will disagree though) And while I'd certainly applaud anyone focusing on water salts, that isn't something I'd really stress on the first 10 batches either.
*Uses a Starter, for dry yeast at that. I agree with others that this gravity of beer needs more than one packet, but simply use 2 and you're good. There is no need for the starter complication.

Recipe #2
*Uses only 3 malts, but adds the complication of 2 different sugars in the boil. (I'm not even certain both are necessary at that stage)
*Adds various flavors and lactose at multiple points in the brew day, including the complication of making a tincture.

I'm not saying don't brew them, but if you really are just starting out, I'd opt for something much simpler with 1 or 2 malts, 1 hop, 1 mash rest (those two recipes thankfully follow that save for the Sparge), and no extra flavoring additions (so you learn what the malts and hops and yeast contribute on their own). I'd go so far as to cheerlead for SMaSH brews. (Single Malt and Single Hop)

A friend who has been brewing for 25 years with others just bought his own new system. I helped him break it in with 3 SMaSH Pale Ales before he attempted something more complicated for brew #4. The entire purpose was to not only learn a new base malt and some new hops, but more importantly to learn the new system and how it affected the step by step brew day process. (every system is different!) Learning the steps of a brew day and getting very comfortable with them is my best advice. You'll reduce the variables that can lead to bad, or at least lackluster beer, and you'll then be more than ready to tackle very involved recipes and processes.

But heh, I did a few 'kitchen sink' brews myself early on. (I tend to learn the hard way) By all means, if you want to- brew 'em!

Oh, and one last thing, in my personal experience, my brewing buddies and I have adopted a rule to never crack a brew until the boil. But go ahead, drink during the mash, find out!

 

[Brewer #404298]

@Mont Y. Märzen. Great advice and info. Thank you.

 

[Sandy Feet]

Sure.

Recipe #1
*Has 7 (but his notes show he used 8) different malts. Do you know why each one is there? What flavors and aromas each one contributes? What percentages are enough to detect them? Which ones could be left out or substituted? I'm not saying each one doesn't play a vital or even important nuanced part, but without knowing what each malt does, that is complication.
*Uses Sparging, *and* treats the strike and sparging water separately with salts. Sparging isn't the easiest thing to get right and especially with all of those dark grains, can get you lots of astringency if not done properly. I wouldn't say that method is a good one for even your first 10 brews. (I'm sure many folks here will disagree though) And while I'd certainly applaud anyone focusing on water salts, that isn't something I'd really stress on the first 10 batches either.
*Uses a Starter, for dry yeast at that. I agree with others that this gravity of beer needs more than one packet, but simply use 2 and you're good. There is no need for the starter complication.

Recipe #2
*Uses only 3 malts, but adds the complication of 2 different sugars in the boil. (I'm not even certain both are necessary at that stage)
*Adds various flavors and lactose at multiple points in the brew day, including the complication of making a tincture.

I'm not saying don't brew them, but if you really are just starting out, I'd opt for something much simpler with 1 or 2 malts, 1 hop, 1 mash rest (those two recipes thankfully follow that save for the Sparge), and no extra flavoring additions (so you learn what the malts and hops and yeast contribute on their own). I'd go so far as to cheerlead for SMaSH brews. (Single Malt and Single Hop)

A friend who has been brewing for 25 years with others just bought his own new system. I helped him break it in with 3 SMaSH Pale Ales before he attempted something more complicated for brew #4. The entire purpose was to not only learn a new base malt and some new hops, but more importantly to learn the new system and how it affected the step by step brew day process. (every system is different!) Learning the steps of a brew day and getting very comfortable with them is my best advice. You'll reduce the variables that can lead to bad, or at least lackluster beer, and you'll then be more than ready to tackle very involved recipes and processes.

But heh, I did a few 'kitchen sink' brews myself early on. (I tend to learn the hard way) By all means, if you want to- brew 'em!

Oh, and one last thing, in my personal experience, my brewing buddies and I have adopted a rule to never crack a brew until the boil. But go ahead, drink during the mash, find out!

I agree with just about everything. I still don't mess with water. Publix Spring Water makes great beer. Commercially, it would be expensive, but not for homebrew.
The first few should either be very simple or very forgiving. My first BIAB was (or was supposed to be) a Brown Ale (very forgiving). My second was an all Cascade Pale Ale which I was very fond of (very simple).

 

[Bigbre04]

I agree with just about everything. I still don't mess with water. Publix Spring Water makes great beer. Commercially, it would be expensive, but not for homebrew.
The first few should either be very simple or very forgiving. My first BIAB was (or was supposed to be) a Brown Ale (very forgiving). My second was an all Cascade Pale Ale which I was very fond of (very simple).

IF you have decent city water, you should be fine.

I use Tybee Island water(which is fine for brewing). I am getting a basic water filter installed soon. Just to address chlorine.

You can also get your water tested for not a ton of money($50) and they will give you a full report. I dont sweat the water. I add 20g of CaCl2 and 20g of Gypsum and that is it.

There are commercial breweries that do RO water, but it is wildly expensive and wasteful. In my personal experience, most breweries do basic filtration and then add in some salts for the "house water". I have always been part of the "your water makes your beer unique" camp.

 

[Sandy Feet]

IF you have decent city water, you should be fine.

I use Tybee Island water(which is fine for brewing). I am getting a basic water filter installed soon. Just to address chlorine.

You can also get your water tested for not a ton of money($50) and they will give you a full report. I dont sweat the water. I add 20g of CaCl2 and 20g of Gypsum and that is it.

There are commercial breweries that do RO water, but it is wildly expensive and wasteful. In my personal experience, most breweries do basic filtration and then add in some salts for the "house water". I have always been part of the "your water makes your beer unique" camp.

Unless you live in Florida where the tap water truly sucks. LOL

 

[Bigbre04]

Unless you live in Florida where the tap water truly sucks. LOL

Our tap water is not amazing, and I am hoping for an inline filter to be installed when we redo our plumbing. But mineral wise it is not terrible. I get it tested at least twice a year and update my water calcs on here based on the most current water test.

 

[Sandy Feet]

Even the bottled water that they filter on the municipal systems sucks here (Think Dasani). At times, you can smell the chlorine from the tap water at home. I believe a lot of the big boys here use RO or have some serious filters. When you get up around Jacksonville or St Augustine, it is even worse than here.
The Publix spring water I use for beer is sourced from the Silver Springs area near Ocala. If used in coffee, you notice a BIG difference over the tap water. For beer, it has done well for me overall.

 

[Bigbre04]

Even the bottled water that they filter on the municipal systems sucks here (Think Dasani). At times, you can smell the chlorine from the tap water at home. I believe a lot of the big boys here use RO or have some serious filters. When you get up around Jacksonville or St Augustine, it is even worse than here.
The Publix spring water I use for beer is sourced from the Silver Springs area near Ocala. If used in coffee, you notice a BIG difference over the tap water. For beer, it has done well for me overall.

Very interesting. We are not too far north of Jax/St. Aug.

Savannah City water is actually not bad for brewing. We had a standard carbon filter(very large)setup for the water coming in, but that was it. We added Gypsum and CaCl2. Same as what I use here. My only negative is that the water is a little hard and has some chlorine(carbon filter would knock it right out).

Im not sure if you can see my water chemistry on my recipes but ill post it if you are interested.

Also the bottled water being sourced locally makes perfect sense.

 

[Sandy Feet]

I think they bottle it from Hollywood down south, not here.
I appreciate it, but right now keeping things very simple. If I get to the point where I need to save some money, I might play around with some profiles.
I was desperate the other week as Publix was out of the store brand, so I had to buy the name brand for double the price. That sucked, but my grain at the HB store is fairly reasonable.