Designing My First Cream Ale

Prairie Dog

Prairie Dog

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Hi all,

I made this cream ale recipe to brew in the next few weeks and had some questions: https://www.brewersfriend.com/homebrew/recipe/view/1545332/you-have-been-creamed

I was wondering if the % of adjuncts makes sense to you guys? I went with about 15% flaked corn, 10% dextrose, and 5% flaked rice. I decided to split the base malt between 2-row and pilsner, though I was maybe thinking of using 6-row, since I've never used it before and the BJCP guidelines include it in their description.

What about the hops? I went simple. One small bittering addition of Magnum to reach 15 IBUs. I decided to go with Magnum since I have some on hand. I also have some Chinook and EKG, but I thought Magnum makes the most sense. Should I do a flavor or aroma addition? I'm thinking Magnum will be fine in a cream ale, but if it is out of place, I can pick up something else.

My homebrew store its out of the WL-080 Cream Ale yeast right now, but I'm hoping I can get my hands on some, if not, I might just use US-05, but if anyone else has suggestions, I appreciate it. Thanks, everyone!
 
My opinion —->

I think the recipe is fine but probably a little unnecessarily busy in the grain bill. Pils, corn and a little less sugar is really all you need. I like to keep my Cream Ale as light and as crisp as possible.
Magnum to bitter is perfect. If you want to add a little bit of a German noble hops at flameout, fine. Saaz, Mittelfruh, Tettnanger, Spalt. Or not.
WLP080 makes the best Cream Ale. Period. Short of that, you want the cleanest yeast you can get your hands on. US-05 would be ok in a pinch, but how about W-34/70? I know it’s a lager yeast, but it ferments nice and clean at low-ish ale temps, say low to mid 60’s. BRY-97 or a Kolsch yeast would be other good choices.

I really like this recipe:
https://www.brewersfriend.com/homebrew/recipe/view/971714/cream-sh-boogie-bop

Good luck. Keep us posted!
 
I am going to comment because my Pro Pro Lager has a very simple, but similar grain bill.
Are you trying to thin it out with the rice? If not, I would just use corn and grain.
For my Pre Pro, I used 6 Row, but you could use 2 row as well and get it to ferment lower. I used 7.4% flaked corn. For me, with my BIAB set-up, I didn't want to go too much higher than that because my adjuncts don't ferment worth a shit. I added 3.7% Cara Pils just to give it some color and head retention.
If you want to try something different, I liked using a whole lot more, very low alpha Crystal Hops (My understanding is that it is a hybrid of Cascade and Hallertau). I went 25IBUs. If you have the ability to do it as a lager, 34/70 works great in a style like that.
If you are going to mix the Pils and the 2 Row because you want it to make a difference, look at a floor malted Pils, maybe a Bohemian, but get something with some character. Otherwise, save the money and get 2 row.
I am just throwing shit out there from what I have done, and anyone out there can tell me I am full of it and is welcome to tell me to go to hell:)
 
I'm following...
I'll want to try something like this one of these days...
 
Lose the sugar and up the Pilsner to make up for it. You have plenty of adjunct thinning with the corn and rice. You could do it with just corn but rice gives a little different sweetness to the finish but still keeps it dry. Consider a little hit of Cluster hops late in the boil. Not a lot but enough to add a few IBUs and a bit of classic hop flavor.

That being said, I make mine with nothing but 80/20 Pilsner and corn and 20 IBUs worth of Cluster and Saaz hops. I've used S-33 dry yeast and S-23 dry yeast each alone and pitched together and any combination works beautifully pitched at 60F and ramped to 65F over the first 4 days. I'll put it up against anything out there. :) This thread makes me want to put it in my brew schedule real soon. :)
 
The recipe is fine as is. Cream Ales can vary a lot and your recipe will work just fine. If you can't get the yeast you want, use 34/70 and treat it like an ale yeast. I just brewed a Cold IPA and used 34/70, it's really clean at 65F. Throws some sulfur, but it goes away pretty quickly.
 
Thanks for all the help, guys! I think I'm going to get rid of the flaked rice and maybe consider only using one malt for the base. Looks like most people are recommending pilsner, so I might go with that. I was a little nervous about all the adjuncts since I'm doing BIAB, and I wasn't sure how much utility I could get out of them.

It seems like I might not be able to find the WL-080 locally, so I probably will have to change the yeast. I do not have a fermentation chamber and will be throwing the fermenter in my closet which is about 64-66F. I guess I'm a little wary of using lager yeast at these temps, but it seems like most of you agree that 34/70 can be fermented at ale temps?
 
Prairie Dog said:
Thanks for all the help, guys! I think I'm going to get rid of the flaked rice and maybe consider only using one malt for the base. Looks like most people are recommending pilsner, so I might go with that. I was a little nervous about all the adjuncts since I'm doing BIAB, and I wasn't sure how much utility I could get out of them.

It seems like I might not be able to find the WL-080 locally, so I probably will have to change the yeast. I do not have a fermentation chamber and will be throwing the fermenter in my closet which is about 64-66F. I guess I'm a little wary of using lager yeast at these temps, but it seems like most of you agree that 34/70 can be fermented at ale temps?
Click to expand...
Coolish ale temps, yes. Try and keep it in the low-mid 60’s.
If you keep the sugar, you can expect to be on the higher end of the yeast’s attenuation range. At least, that’s what I’ve found. You may get a bit more ABV than you are aiming for.
 
Megary said:
Coolish ale temps, yes. Try and keep it in the low-mid 60’s.
If you keep the sugar, you can expect to be on the higher end of the yeast’s attenuation range. At least, that’s what I’ve found. You may get a bit more ABV than you are aiming for.
Click to expand...

Thanks! I think it is going to be hard for me to keep it in the low 60s. My basement is pretty cool, but we are having huge fluctuations in temperature in Colorado right now (normal for late winter... or just about anytime), so I might want to try a kolsch yeast or something. My closet upstairs is like 64-66 all the time, so I'd probably need something that would work well in that temperature range.
 
Prairie Dog said:
Thanks for all the help, guys! I think I'm going to get rid of the flaked rice and maybe consider only using one malt for the base. Looks like most people are recommending pilsner, so I might go with that. I was a little nervous about all the adjuncts since I'm doing BIAB, and I wasn't sure how much utility I could get out of them.

It seems like I might not be able to find the WL-080 locally, so I probably will have to change the yeast. I do not have a fermentation chamber and will be throwing the fermenter in my closet which is about 64-66F. I guess I'm a little wary of using lager yeast at these temps, but it seems like most of you agree that 34/70 can be fermented at ale temps?
Click to expand...
S-23 is probably better than 34/70 for this particular style. Stay between 60 and 64 if you have temp control but let it raise in temp to 68 when it gets within about 5 points of FG - that'll help it attenuate and will work in some esters without being extremely fruity. Same goes for 34/70 but it tends to be a little more "German Lager" even at relatively higher temps.
Either will definitely work but S-23 has more of the right character. Don't be skimpy on the pitch...use the full packet for your 3+ gallons and you'll have a good strong fermentation, even at pretty low temps.
 
Zambi said:
I'm following...
I'll want to try something like this one of these days...
Click to expand...
Cream Ales and Pro Pros appear to be very similar with the recipes.
My favorite brewery that closed got me absolutely hooked on a Pre Pro Lager. It ran about 5.3 or so percent. It was based on a recipe type that was American before the prohibition era. My understanding is that 6 Row was what was available at the time, so that is what they used. This brewery used a malt from River Bend in Asheville, and every time I see their malt used in a style I like, I normally like the beer. They make some good shit. I liked it enough that it was my first lager to make at home. In that era, they added corn to the grain as it was readily available. The more modern recipes I see use either Crystal or Cluster hops to equate to what was available at the time. It is a great, very simple beer.
There is also a darker version that they either call a Pre Pro Porter or a Pennsylvania Porter. It that version, they use molasses. It was a Benjamin Franklin recipe.
They had it on at the brewery I love to visit on Sunday for a couple of months. They called it a Kentucky Common, but when I tasted it and found out what it was, I was in heaven.
Traditional beers, both American and European are very, very cool.
 
Well if you start using lager you are into a Pre Pro lager. Now the corn was originally used because of the unmodified 6-row so if you're not using 6-row or even 2-row and using Pilsner I'd drop the flaked corn and brew an American Pilsner. Pilsner malt has it own flavor the corn will muddy it. That said the recipe looks fine
 
Brew Cat said:
Well if you start using lager you are into a Pre Pro lager. Now the corn was originally used because of the unmodified 6-row so if you're not using 6-row or even 2-row and using Pilsner I'd drop the flaked corn and brew an American Pilsner. Pilsner malt has it own flavor the corn will muddy it. That said the recipe looks fine
Click to expand...

This is one of the reasons why I wanted to keep 2-row or 6-row in the recipe: so it was more in-keeping with the traditional style, but everyone's comments on here made me switch to using only Pilsner malt. Maybe I'll reconsider. I've never used 6-row, and I was curious to try it with this style.
 
Prairie Dog said:
This is one of the reasons why I wanted to keep 2-row or 6-row in the recipe: so it was more in-keeping with the traditional style, but everyone's comments on here made me switch to using only Pilsner malt. Maybe I'll reconsider. I've never used 6-row, and I was curious to try it with this style.
Click to expand...
You may or may not really perceive the difference in the malt since it's a fairly light beer without a lot of depth to the flavor. Pre-Pro is a little different in that it's a bigger beer with deeper malt flavor that might show more of a distinction depending on different malts used. Though I usually just use Pilsner and 2-row for a Pre-Pro, I'd consider 6-row for that. I mostly don't use it because I buy base malt by the bag so I always have a good supply of Pilsner and 2-row to work with.
Even though I almost always use Pilsner for Cream Ales, I have a lot more 2-row right now so my next batch will be made with that. Bottom line, Cream Ale is a style that's pretty forgiving. Sometimes it becomes a catch-all for brewers wanting to add odd-ball ingredients like Fruity Pebbles and Kettle Corn. :)
As long as you keep it pretty simple, you'll be in line with what the style guidelines prescribe.
 
You probably will not perceive much of a difference in the 2 row or 6 row. The 6 row won't ferment down quite as much and leave just a little more of a residual sweetness.
 
There is no advantage to 6 row malt. Modern North American 2 row can have diastatic power from 130-150 points (to the horror of German brewers, they consider that way too high).

In the old days, 6 row was an advantage when using adjuncts, but they needed adjuncts to deal with the high protein levels of 6 row. As 2 row was bred and developed, growers produced 2 row varieties that could handle adjuncts and get the DP to 6 row levels without the high protein levels. 6 row is becoming less and less common because modern American 2 row is superior and favored by brewers.
 
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