Current plan for force carbing correctly

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Sandy Feet

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The beers I have made and kegged have been good as hell, but I have been struggling with the foam as I found out they have been way over carbonated. I have a plan this time for tomorrow, and hopefully I am on the right track.
I use a picnic tap with a short line.
I know that the keg needs to be sealed, so I think I am going to take her up to 30PSI and then shut off the CO2. After it falls overnight, I am going to turn the CO2 back on in the morning and keep it on. I plan on 11.5 PSI for about 5 days (approx 2.5 volumes). After the five days, I plan on releasing the CO2 and repressuring to around 4 PSI to serve. The keg and the tap line will remain in the refrigerator the entire time. After reading and watching videos, that seems like a plan.
It is my understating that once the CO2 is absorbed and left cold in the refrigerator, the 4 PSI should work just for serving even for an extended period of time.
Does anything seem wrong with my understanding or reasoning?
 
If you are trying to force carb using temp and time, just set your regulator at your needed pressure and let it ride!

I am not sure why you would need to bump the PSI up to 30, but this could add some carb to your liquid in a fairly short time. I assume that you are trying to seat the seals? Unless that is something relating to ball locks that I am not familiar with, your normal carb pressures would be more then sufficient with the spring pressure to seal it up?

What I would do is pull a pint or 2 off and then crank the PSI up to 30psi and shake the shit out of it. let it settle for a min pour a little out and taste it. rinse and repeat until it is carbed. It takes effort but you can dial the carb in by mouthfeel relatively quickly depending on how cold it is.

11.5psi seems relatively low? What carb chart are you using? I would think that it would need to be higher than that for to carb that quickly.

When packing kegs we generally shoot to leave the keg at around 12-14 psi in order to not loose or gain carbonation. Dont worry about the slightly higher pressure as the keg will not gain much over time without adding more pressure to it. It will basically just equalize and maintain. My kegs have consistent carb even after a month or more of sitting in the cooler.

https://brulosophy.com/methods/carbonation-methods/

The above article seems pretty good if you needed it.

IF your kegs are overly foamy you can do the opposite of the shaking method, basically drop the pressure in the keg and then shake it to break CO2 out to get your total carb under control.

Hope this helps.
 
Sandy Feet said:
The beers I have made and kegged have been good as hell, but I have been struggling with the foam as I found out they have been way over carbonated. I have a plan this time for tomorrow, and hopefully I am on the right track.
I use a picnic tap with a short line.
I know that the keg needs to be sealed, so I think I am going to take her up to 30PSI and then shut off the CO2. After it falls overnight, I am going to turn the CO2 back on in the morning and keep it on. I plan on 11.5 PSI for about 5 days (approx 2.5 volumes). After the five days, I plan on releasing the CO2 and repressuring to around 4 PSI to serve. The keg and the tap line will remain in the refrigerator the entire time. After reading and watching videos, that seems like a plan.
It is my understating that once the CO2 is absorbed and left cold in the refrigerator, the 4 PSI should work just for serving even for an extended period of time.
Does anything seem wrong with my understanding or reasoning?
Click to expand...

So here is what I do: After kegging, I bump up the pressure to 30-40 PSI and rock the keg until I get bored (2-3 minutes). Then I leave it on the pressure (I am very careful about leaks!) overnight (if already cold) or a bit longer (if starting from warm). I then drop it to carbonating pressure for the temperature (at 38 F an IPA gets about 12 PSI). and shut off the gas. There it sits for days, weeks or months. I *might* verify the pressure every few weeks if it's been a while.

I also use picnic taps on short hoses. I pull the pressure release until it is almost fully depressurized. I start to pour and, if it is too slow I put a short burst of pressure in, and if too fast I pull the PRV again. If we'll be on the keg for a while, I might set the gas pressure to 1-3 PSI. Usually we pull a pitcher, after which I put the gas back up to 12 PSI (or whatever).

Note that a full keg has little airspace, so pressure will drop fast while pouring beer. A half-full keg might go 5-6 pitchers before needing a gas burst.

Dumping the CO2 from a nearly empty keg seems wasteful, but overall the gas is pretty cheap, a 5 lb bottle lasts me more than several months.

In the future, I will play with much longer picnic tap lines and/or get a pressure-control tap. We'll see.
 
I carb @ 35psi for 2 days, then set it for the psi it will serve at.

Took me a while to tame the foam. EV barrier tubing helped more than anything
 
The plan was for the patient method: set the seals. After that, leave it, gas on, not touching it at 11.5 to 12 30 something degrees for 5 days. After that, Co 2 should be absorbed I'm assuming. Not looking to drink it immediately. It is going to need to lager for a couple of weeks anyway. This is a Corny keg and after filling it from the Fermonster. 11.5 isn't much much, but for 5 days should be 2.5 volumes per the chart?
 
Just read big breS article. O.k maybe I am a little low. Maybe 15 for 5 days and see where she sits if I shut her off?
 
Sandy Feet said:
Just read big breS article. O.k maybe I am a little low. Maybe 15 for 5 days and see where she sits if I shut her off?
Click to expand...
Once all the CO2 dissolves into the beer, you can shut off the gas. Shut it off earlier and it might not carb all the way, and it could end up taking longer than five days.

That's the reason for the high pressure for the first day. You get it carbonated and then you don't have to leave the gas on to compensate for any more CO2 that dissolves, since it's already saturated.
 
Wow it's amazing how many different methods there are.

Sandy it's your short serving line.

I like sunfires set and forget method personally.

Mines 10psi ish

I run 4.5m 4mm ID Eva barrier line Like minibari s got that's that good sh#t man!

I can serve some high carbed beer if need be.

Picnic taps are a PITA to get a good pour on served beer on one for a few years had 2 intertaps and one Picnic tap on kegerator for a while...
 
I am going to set and forget. I did carb to 30 yesterday and shut the tank off. It is around 15 this morning, and I did set to 12 and turned the regulator back on. I might try to taste it next Sunday, but I don't plan on touching it until then.
It tasted pretty damn good when flat, but it didn't attenuate very well. It was 50% Pils/30 Munich/20 Vienna, and I have a feeling that much Munich and Vienna was the reason.
All of this with the lagers is a huge learning experience, and as I lean more things, I might get to be a little more confident. I certainly have a bigger appreciation for some of these breweries when we go out, and I can taste some of the variations in recipes now.
 
I go a little different again
But I don't really know what I am doing.
I carb at 30 psi overnight at room temperature (my room temp, so hot)
Then cool and proceed with 30 psi bursts.
Occasionally using my spunding valve to check the pressure.
If I get anywhere close to 12-15, I stop.
I just pour as it, every now and again topping up pressure.
It works for me, but there are much better ways esp if you can keep your co2 cylinder in the fridge and attached to the keg
 
Sandy Feet said:
I am going to set and forget. I did carb to 30 yesterday and shut the tank off. It is around 15 this morning, and I did set to 12 and turned the regulator back on. I might try to taste it next Sunday, but I don't plan on touching it until then.
It tasted pretty damn good when flat, but it didn't attenuate very well. It was 50% Pils/30 Munich/20 Vienna, and I have a feeling that much Munich and Vienna was the reason.
All of this with the lagers is a huge learning experience, and as I lean more things, I might get to be a little more confident. I certainly have a bigger appreciation for some of these breweries when we go out, and I can taste some of the variations in recipes now.
Click to expand...
Patience is tough, but sometimes the best option. I've learned this the hard way in brewing many, many times

What temperature did you mash at? I've done 100% Vienna and 100% Munich batches that attenuated just fine
 
We run a long draw system with 8 taps at work. It is about 80ft from coolers to taps through 3/8 bev line. The lines Choke down to 1/4 inch with restrictors(to accommodate the variation in actual draw length within the cooler. We recirculate glycol at 30f. Our Cooler sits at 34-36F. We push with Beer Gas(nitrogen and CO2 Blend) at around 20 PSI. Kegs are filled at approximately 14 PSI from the Tanks.

Getting this system to pour correctly required outside assistance from a draft tech. It was very interesting to work on this stuff, but at the end of the day, experience far surpassed online calculators lol.

This was the first time that I have ever installed a long draw system and it was pretty interesting. I have mostly done "through the cooler wall" type draft systems. If anyone is interested i can probably dig up some pictures of it being built.
 
Here is what I do. It may sound crazy but it works for me.

After cold crashing I keg and set the CO2 to 30PSI and shake the keg for as long as I feel like it. Then I put a spunding valve on (no CO2 connected) and let it sit for 24 to 36 hours. When the reading on the spunding valve drops to 15PSI, I put it in the kegerator and pull a couple pints to test. After that my serving pressure is 10 -12 PSI. This method has worked for me. No foam.
 
Bigbre04 said:
We run a long draw system with 8 taps at work. It is about 80ft from coolers to taps through 3/8 bev line. The lines Choke down to 1/4 inch with restrictors(to accommodate the variation in actual draw length within the cooler. We recirculate glycol at 30f. Our Cooler sits at 34-36F. We push with Beer Gas(nitrogen and CO2 Blend) at around 20 PSI. Kegs are filled at approximately 14 PSI from the Tanks.

Getting this system to pour correctly required outside assistance from a draft tech. It was very interesting to work on this stuff, but at the end of the day, experience far surpassed online calculators lol.

This was the first time that I have ever installed a long draw system and it was pretty interesting. I have mostly done "through the cooler wall" type draft systems. If anyone is interested i can probably dig up some pictures of it being built.
Click to expand...
Oh you know I wanna see.

Now that's some long line lengths wow.
I'm amazed that 14psi got a good pour I woulda thought it might need even more to ballance out that long line length.

You don't have any flow control capabilities on your taps?

I've never run any but I hear Flow control can help deal with foam issues with short line lengths or overcarbonation...
 
Trialben said:
Oh you know I wanna see.

Now that's some long line lengths wow.
I'm amazed that 14psi got a good pour I woulda thought it might need even more to ballance out that long line length.

You don't have any flow control capabilities on your taps?

I've never run any but I hear Flow control can help deal with foam issues with short line lengths or overcarbonation...
Click to expand...
The 14 psi is just the head pressure from the tank in order to keep the kegs carbed until they are tapped.

We push at 20 psi with beer gas. Fast fill with minimal foam. Our draft guy is a bad ass with tuning systems. He just helps us out but his main gigs are running draft systems for major league stadiums(football, baseball, etc.).

No flow control on our faucets. We use all SS Krome dispense faucets. I have used flow controls before and they can help if you are having issues, but the new bartenders will always try to mess with things and fuck the whole thing up. IF its just you using the draft, flow control is awesome.
 
20231112_141551.jpg
Proof that the set and forget method works. This is a small glass too. I tried a full glass on Friday and turned down the CO2 a tick over the weekend. It is pouring exactly the way that I want.
 
Sandy Feet said:
View attachment 27280Proof that the set and forget method works. This is a small glass too. I tried a full glass on Friday and turned down the CO2 a tick over the weekend. It is pouring exactly the way that I want.
Click to expand...
It definitely works. Just takes longer
 
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